I might have been able to forgive Joss for it had it not been for the deaths of Wash, Bennett and Topher in Firefly and Dollhouse respectively. The man has a knack for killing off my favorites.

And as to “Sam barely cares about his father” — I don’t know if that’s true. It’s what the character of Sam was putting forth, but obviously he cares about his father. Further, the writing of the show could be made to reflect the situation accordingly.

And please, please, don’t call me “Mr. Wendig.” Go with “Chuck,” or “Charles,” or, “My Dark Overlord.”

– c.

Righto. I’ll note that I loved Serenity, actually, equal to my love for the TV show. Wash’s death was the only I had with the movie (and Wash dying actually makes me forget about Book’s death).

And you nailed part of my issue with the Penny death. Whedon didn’t weave in the throughline of darkness throughout, as he did with, say, Firefly or Serenity. Penny’s death shatters the tone of the previous episodes, and for me, not in a good way.

For the record, though, I hope Whedon continues to champion the Internet model and really make something of it.

– c.

I liked Serenity more than most people did (like I’ve said before, for some reason I’m less critical about my movies than my books). That said, Wash’s death was a “WTF?” moment for me. Not merely for its purposelessness, but for its flippant tone, which was WAY jarring. That significantly brought me out of the narrative and mucked with my experience of the movie.

Similarly, Penny’s death in Dr. Horrible was jarring to me as well. In just the way that Wash’s death was an oddly flippant and silly moment in a tragic and tense set of scenes, Penny’s death was an oddly tragic moment in an otherwise wacky and light-hearted narrative. Not that you can’t have those things together, but it takes some real skill to pull off, and it just didn’t work for me there.

I agree that Joss became overly reliant on killing off characters. I think that’s part of why it started to feel out-of-place and discordant to me—if the death doesn’t serve a purpose, then it’s likely to feel rather random.

First point, you’re selling me a little more on Penny’s death as conflict and character motivator. I’m still sure I would’ve done it differently, and I still cast a wary glance at Whedon for hobbling along on that crutch one too many times. But, I’ll grant you good ideas.

Second point, I think the creative curse is a myth. That assumes that the creator is smarter than the audience, which I don’t think is true. My wife counts firmly as “audience,” and she’s *constantly* able to guess the outcome of events in shows and films before I do. Point is, People Who Watch TV have seen it before. People Who Watch Whedon as fans are fully aware of what someone like that has done in the past, and are looking for repeats. I’ve little doubt some people really dug Penny’s death in Horrible; that said, I know of people who responded to it much differently than those who watched it with you, who saw it as kind of an eye-rolling “duh” moment rather than a surprising or heartbreaking conclusion.

– c.

Seasons 1-3 are wrapped and waiting for me to open on Crimmas Morn.

I’ll come back to this post in a few months.

I watched Dr. H with several people who don’t suffer from the Curse, and the heartache and genuine emotional response that Penny’s death got for them is something I’d want to be able to create.

And for my own creative itches, I like seeing protags get hit right in the teeth with consequences of their choices. You’re right; H could have had Penny if he’d been less villainous. But he chose to be villainous even though it was clear his heart wasn’t in it, letting his ire at Hammer overtake his chance to be a better guy. And so his heart got ripped out for his trouble, externalized in her death.

I sit down to watch something Whedon does, I’m in it for the tragicomedic elements. Penny lives, I’m feeling I get a weaker story, not a better one.

Totally agreed on that point. A master stroke, indeed. Placed perfectly, made so we really care, and remains a powerful driving force — doesn’t remove conflict, but creates it, and creates motivation.

– c.