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	<title>Comments on: Your First Draft: Close Enough For Horseshoes And Hand Grenades</title>
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	<link>http://terribleminds.com/ramble/2009/11/09/your-first-draft-close-enough-for-horseshoes-and-hand-grenades/</link>
	<description>Chuck Wendig: Freelance Penmonkey</description>
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		<title>By: TERRIBLEMINDS: Chuck Wendig, Freelance Penmonkey &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Souls For The Soulless: Advice On Characters In Fiction</title>
		<link>http://terribleminds.com/ramble/2009/11/09/your-first-draft-close-enough-for-horseshoes-and-hand-grenades/comment-page-1/#comment-2508</link>
		<dc:creator>TERRIBLEMINDS: Chuck Wendig, Freelance Penmonkey &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Souls For The Soulless: Advice On Characters In Fiction</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Nov 2009 11:32:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://terribleminds.com/ramble/?p=1611#comment-2508</guid>
		<description>[...] errm, not really. Listen, as I said the other day, writing is very much like horseshoes or hand grenades &#8212; you&#8217;re just trying to get [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] errm, not really. Listen, as I said the other day, writing is very much like horseshoes or hand grenades &#8212; you&#8217;re just trying to get [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Cut Scenes &#38; Cut Characters :Blue Ink Alchemy</title>
		<link>http://terribleminds.com/ramble/2009/11/09/your-first-draft-close-enough-for-horseshoes-and-hand-grenades/comment-page-1/#comment-2454</link>
		<dc:creator>Cut Scenes &#38; Cut Characters :Blue Ink Alchemy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Nov 2009 15:51:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://terribleminds.com/ramble/?p=1611#comment-2454</guid>
		<description>[...] in mind. Posting these clips from my old manuscript helps to show me how far my writing has come. Chuck Wendig is right in that by writing more, even if it&#8217;s crap, we learn how not to write crap and [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] in mind. Posting these clips from my old manuscript helps to show me how far my writing has come. Chuck Wendig is right in that by writing more, even if it&#8217;s crap, we learn how not to write crap and [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Chuck</title>
		<link>http://terribleminds.com/ramble/2009/11/09/your-first-draft-close-enough-for-horseshoes-and-hand-grenades/comment-page-1/#comment-2439</link>
		<dc:creator>Chuck</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Nov 2009 02:58:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://terribleminds.com/ramble/?p=1611#comment-2439</guid>
		<description>Josh:

Well, sure -- and I follow a similar path. I wrote novels throughout, all crap. On the one hand, I learned a lot. That said, I don&#039;t know that those were necessary steps, either. After all, I was young, and I don&#039;t think it was particularly possible that I write something of caliber at that point. I dunno. Skill, patience, comprehension -- these come with time, not necessarily with failed attempts. If you had endeavored three full drafts when you were 12, or 18, you wouldn&#039;t be in the position you were now, feeling confident and possessing what may be the proper course for the tale.

Mind you, I&#039;m not knocking this approach; again, it&#039;s the same way I&#039;ve gone with it. 

These days, though, I don&#039;t have time to write crap manuscripts.

-- c.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Josh:</p>
<p>Well, sure &#8212; and I follow a similar path. I wrote novels throughout, all crap. On the one hand, I learned a lot. That said, I don&#8217;t know that those were necessary steps, either. After all, I was young, and I don&#8217;t think it was particularly possible that I write something of caliber at that point. I dunno. Skill, patience, comprehension &#8212; these come with time, not necessarily with failed attempts. If you had endeavored three full drafts when you were 12, or 18, you wouldn&#8217;t be in the position you were now, feeling confident and possessing what may be the proper course for the tale.</p>
<p>Mind you, I&#8217;m not knocking this approach; again, it&#8217;s the same way I&#8217;ve gone with it. </p>
<p>These days, though, I don&#8217;t have time to write crap manuscripts.</p>
<p>&#8211; c.</p>
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		<title>By: Josh</title>
		<link>http://terribleminds.com/ramble/2009/11/09/your-first-draft-close-enough-for-horseshoes-and-hand-grenades/comment-page-1/#comment-2438</link>
		<dc:creator>Josh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Nov 2009 02:40:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://terribleminds.com/ramble/?p=1611#comment-2438</guid>
		<description>I started my first novel roughly 18 years ago.  I was 12 and I wanted to write about a spy.  An American James Bond.  Somebody who could be cool in the ways I knew then I&#039;d never be.  I&#039;d never be an astronaut or a naval aviator or even a submariner.  I didn&#039;t have the chops and I knew it.  But I knew I could write about it, so I tried.

It was crap.

I tried again, in college, with the same character only female.  It was better.  It flowed more freely.  I kept the story tighter, had bad things happen to characters I liked, avoided adverbs when possible and ended up with a much better manuscript.

It still wasn&#039;t right.

So now I&#039;m rewriting for a third time.  It&#039;s going much better, it&#039;s much more interesting and definitely more in line with the speculative fiction that seems to be my niche.  What does this have to do with this advice I probably shouldn&#039;t be taking?

I wouldn&#039;t be this confident about what I&#039;m writing now if I hadn&#039;t written a completely crap manuscript from end to end - not once, but twice.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I started my first novel roughly 18 years ago.  I was 12 and I wanted to write about a spy.  An American James Bond.  Somebody who could be cool in the ways I knew then I&#8217;d never be.  I&#8217;d never be an astronaut or a naval aviator or even a submariner.  I didn&#8217;t have the chops and I knew it.  But I knew I could write about it, so I tried.</p>
<p>It was crap.</p>
<p>I tried again, in college, with the same character only female.  It was better.  It flowed more freely.  I kept the story tighter, had bad things happen to characters I liked, avoided adverbs when possible and ended up with a much better manuscript.</p>
<p>It still wasn&#8217;t right.</p>
<p>So now I&#8217;m rewriting for a third time.  It&#8217;s going much better, it&#8217;s much more interesting and definitely more in line with the speculative fiction that seems to be my niche.  What does this have to do with this advice I probably shouldn&#8217;t be taking?</p>
<p>I wouldn&#8217;t be this confident about what I&#8217;m writing now if I hadn&#8217;t written a completely crap manuscript from end to end &#8211; not once, but twice.</p>
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		<title>By: Sarah</title>
		<link>http://terribleminds.com/ramble/2009/11/09/your-first-draft-close-enough-for-horseshoes-and-hand-grenades/comment-page-1/#comment-2437</link>
		<dc:creator>Sarah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Nov 2009 02:39:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://terribleminds.com/ramble/?p=1611#comment-2437</guid>
		<description>I think Doyce has Bruce Willis eyes.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think Doyce has Bruce Willis eyes.</p>
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		<title>By: Chuck</title>
		<link>http://terribleminds.com/ramble/2009/11/09/your-first-draft-close-enough-for-horseshoes-and-hand-grenades/comment-page-1/#comment-2436</link>
		<dc:creator>Chuck</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Nov 2009 00:15:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://terribleminds.com/ramble/?p=1611#comment-2436</guid>
		<description>Scionic --

I can see that, yeah. Giving some precious part of your manuscript prominence is a dangerous act. And, killing your darlings remains valuable advice.

Editing scripts in general is easier than editing prose. Scripts are light and loose; pull pieces out, put pieces in. Prose work requires a much meaner machete. 

-- c.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Scionic &#8211;</p>
<p>I can see that, yeah. Giving some precious part of your manuscript prominence is a dangerous act. And, killing your darlings remains valuable advice.</p>
<p>Editing scripts in general is easier than editing prose. Scripts are light and loose; pull pieces out, put pieces in. Prose work requires a much meaner machete. </p>
<p>&#8211; c.</p>
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		<title>By: Scionic</title>
		<link>http://terribleminds.com/ramble/2009/11/09/your-first-draft-close-enough-for-horseshoes-and-hand-grenades/comment-page-1/#comment-2435</link>
		<dc:creator>Scionic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 09 Nov 2009 21:51:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://terribleminds.com/ramble/?p=1611#comment-2435</guid>
		<description>I went back off what he said and would look over my favorite parts, and sure enough nine times out of ten I had overinflated it.  You like it so much that you wanna put the shine on it, and you attach more important bits to it left and right... until it the important bit magnet.  I&#039;ve tried taking out my favorite bits before (or at least neutering the fuck out of them) and making the entire thing work by spreading the info out more, and it works better... in practice, it&#039;s easier for a script than with prose.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I went back off what he said and would look over my favorite parts, and sure enough nine times out of ten I had overinflated it.  You like it so much that you wanna put the shine on it, and you attach more important bits to it left and right&#8230; until it the important bit magnet.  I&#8217;ve tried taking out my favorite bits before (or at least neutering the fuck out of them) and making the entire thing work by spreading the info out more, and it works better&#8230; in practice, it&#8217;s easier for a script than with prose.</p>
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		<title>By: Chuck</title>
		<link>http://terribleminds.com/ramble/2009/11/09/your-first-draft-close-enough-for-horseshoes-and-hand-grenades/comment-page-1/#comment-2434</link>
		<dc:creator>Chuck</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 09 Nov 2009 21:05:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://terribleminds.com/ramble/?p=1611#comment-2434</guid>
		<description>Scionic, 

That is either crazy-brilliant, or crazy-crazy. 

I learn toward the former in theory, the latter in practice. 

But it&#039;s a neat concept. 

Hrrrrrrm.

-- c.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Scionic, </p>
<p>That is either crazy-brilliant, or crazy-crazy. </p>
<p>I learn toward the former in theory, the latter in practice. </p>
<p>But it&#8217;s a neat concept. </p>
<p>Hrrrrrrm.</p>
<p>&#8211; c.</p>
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		<title>By: Scionic</title>
		<link>http://terribleminds.com/ramble/2009/11/09/your-first-draft-close-enough-for-horseshoes-and-hand-grenades/comment-page-1/#comment-2432</link>
		<dc:creator>Scionic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 09 Nov 2009 20:22:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://terribleminds.com/ramble/?p=1611#comment-2432</guid>
		<description>I think one of the biggest peices of advice I had on cutting material was &quot;Find the piece you love the most, the part of your script (in this case) that the entire story absolutely can&#039;t do without.  Now cut that fucker out.  If you made it all work off one scene, you did it wrong.&quot;  

What he was basically getting at was that the one bit you love the most you probably had a case of word-shits, and it&#039;s fluffed up higher than Ron Jeremy at an orgy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think one of the biggest peices of advice I had on cutting material was &#8220;Find the piece you love the most, the part of your script (in this case) that the entire story absolutely can&#8217;t do without.  Now cut that fucker out.  If you made it all work off one scene, you did it wrong.&#8221;  </p>
<p>What he was basically getting at was that the one bit you love the most you probably had a case of word-shits, and it&#8217;s fluffed up higher than Ron Jeremy at an orgy.</p>
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		<title>By: Chuck</title>
		<link>http://terribleminds.com/ramble/2009/11/09/your-first-draft-close-enough-for-horseshoes-and-hand-grenades/comment-page-1/#comment-2429</link>
		<dc:creator>Chuck</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 09 Nov 2009 17:09:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://terribleminds.com/ramble/?p=1611#comment-2429</guid>
		<description>Well, said, Will.

I think that, ideally, an outline shouldn&#039;t stop that breakthrough. That breakthough is an essential element, and it may not even come from the original writer -- it may come from outside critiques. In my experience, it often does. Forest for the trees, new perspective, etc.etc.

-- c.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, said, Will.</p>
<p>I think that, ideally, an outline shouldn&#8217;t stop that breakthrough. That breakthough is an essential element, and it may not even come from the original writer &#8212; it may come from outside critiques. In my experience, it often does. Forest for the trees, new perspective, etc.etc.</p>
<p>&#8211; c.</p>
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